In this episode of The BETWEN Podcast, host Matt Mattson dives deeply into the mystical and the concrete with author Kevin Sweeney.

Kevin Sweeney was co-founder and lead pastor of Imagine Church—an urban church in Honolulu that is welcoming of all people, sees imagination as the key to the future, chooses authenticity over performance, substance over hype, and quality over quantity.

He is the host of podcast “The Church Needs Therapy” and is the author of the books, “The Making of a Mystic: My Journey with Mushrooms, My Life as a Pastor, and Why It’s Okay For Everyone to Relax,” out on May 31st, and “The Joy of Letting Go”. His newest book is titled "The Cosmic Christ and the Concrete Jesus: Mystics, The Black Prophetic Tradition, and Why I'm Still A Christian" and is available here: https://www.amazon.com/Cosmic-Christ-Concrete-Jesus-ebook/dp/B0F2Q3P6K2#

He lives In Honolulu with his wife and co-founder of Imagine, Christine, and their two kids, True and Mikayla.

Are you a prophet? Should people claim to be prophets in today's world? What do the prophets of the ancient times have to teach us about the way we're supposed to be with each other today?

Fr. Richard Rohr recently released a new book titled, "The Tears of Things" that Pastor Dani and Matt Mattson discuss in detail on this episode of The BETWEEN Podcast.

The book serves as a jumping off point for a truly sacred conversation to take place... They discuss our inner "prophetic" voice, our ego, seeing the world in new ways through tears-filled eyes, the courage to embrace paradox.

MORE ABOUT THE BOOK

How do we live compassionately in a time of violence and despair? What can we do with our private disappointments and the anger we feel in such an unjust world? In his most personal book yet, Richard Rohr turns to the writings of the Jewish prophets, revealing how some of the lesser-read books of the Bible offer us a crucial path forward today.
The prophets’ writings reflect the full spectrum of human maturity. In almost every case, their initial rage and their accusatory words evolve into a profound pathos and lamentation about our shared human condition and the world’s suffering. Through astute critiques of culture and institutions, and their journey from anger to sadness, and ultimately compassion, the prophets exemplify what Rohr calls “sacred criticism”—a distinct approach to confronting evil and injustice that acknowledges the wholeness of history, the interconnectedness of every living being, and the reality of a divine and universal love. In this, they set the stage for Jesus, who follows this identical pattern.
Drawing on a century of biblical scholarship and written in the warm, pastoral voice that has endeared Rohr to millions, The Tears of Things breathes new life into ancient wisdom. It paves a path of enlightenment for anyone seeking a compassionate way of living in a hurting world.

In this episode of The BETWEEN Podcast, host Matt Mattson and special guest Kate Boyd dive deeply into faith disentanglement, Batman (the dog), the danger of fundamentalism, and the untidiness of our personal and communal faith lives.

Kate Boyd helps weary and wounded Christians rebuild their relationship with Scripture and community... and she helps them love God and their neighbors with their whole selves. Kate has traveled the world to interview and tell the stories of believers around the globe while she has been on mission trips. She is the author of a book we discuss in this episdoed titled, “An Untidy Faith: Journeying Back to the Joy of Following Jesus”. She is also creator of the Threaded Bible studies, and founder of The Remembered Table. She holds a masters in theological studies with an emphasis in biblical studies from Perkins School of Theology.

Are you longing for rest? (you're not alone)

In this episode Dani reveals that the last time she felt rested was NEARLY A DECADE AGO! And we know she is not the only one who feels like they're rushing through life and always expected to be "on."

This episode of The BETWEEN Podcast features co-hosts Matt Mattson and Dani Hillyer doing a deep dive into their relationship (or lackthereof) with REST.

A well-rested person is far more likely to be able to experience the sacredness of human connection, don't you think? We certainly do. Join us for this conversation and maybe you'll find some ways to provide rest for other people in your life.

In this episode, regular host Matt Mattson is joined by Dani Hillyer (in her debut on the show as an occasional co-host). Their sacred conversation is a deep dive into the idea of "worship" and whether it can be something we do in every moment.

Tune in to receive a spiritual invitation, some new perspectives, and an exploration of how your faith might intersect in new ways with the ways you connect with the humans around you.

Rev. Dani Hillyer brings vibrant passion and deep commitment to all of her work -- while she is a co-creator of BETWEEN, her primary professional roles have her serving two local churches in the Denver area as a pastor with a specialization in innovative ministries. ,Her journey into pastoral ministry was sparked during her tenure as a Children and Youth Director. Equipped with an M.Div. from McCormick Theological Seminary and a B.S. in Business Management from Grand Canyon University, her blend of theological depth and practical acumen enriches her ministry. Native to Colorado, Pastor Dani and her family embrace the state's beauty through hiking, paddle boarding, skiing, camping, and exploring mountain towns. Her heart is devoted to cultivating spiritually vibrant environments within families and communities. With dynamic leadership and unwavering dedication, she eagerly looks forward to journeying alongside all she has the honor to pastor, guiding them in deepening their faith and impacting their community.

Grace E. Kelley is a follower of Jesus, a wife, and mother of five, including a set of boy/girl twins. She graduated from Colorado State University with a Bachelors in Creative Writing and a double emphasis in Poetry and Creative Non-Fiction. She writes poetry and stories — both fictional and non-fictional, and occasionally enjoys the opportunity to speak. She is also a farmer, a foodie, an unrepentant mug addict, and a deep believer that incredible beauty can come from the compost heap.

Among her writing credits you can find her debut poetry collection titled, "as the Sparrow flies." And her newest collection that is soon to be released... in fact it might be out by the time you're listening to this episode... it's called, "Daughter of Breath."

In this episode of The BETWEEN Podcast, we explore the challenges of sacred connection... especially for men.

Shannon TL Kearns is a transgender man who believes in the transformative power of story. As an ordained priest, a playwright, a theologian, and a writer all of his work revolves around making meaning through story.

Shannon’s first book In the Margins: A Transgender Man’s Journey With Scripture is available now from Eerdman’s Books. He has three books forthcoming: No One Taught Me How To Be A Man: What A Trans Man’s Experience Reveals About Masculinity (Broadleaf), Come and See: An Invitation To A Radical Encounter With Jesus A Youth Devotional (Hodder Faith), Reading the Bible Through Queer Eyes (HarperOne, co-written with Brian G. Murphy).

Shannon is a recipient of the Louisville Pastoral Study Grant for 2025/2026, the Humanitas New Voices Fellowship for 2022, a Playwrights’ Center Jerome Fellowship in 20/21 and he was a Lambda Literary Fellow for 2019 in playwriting and in 2022 for screenwriting. He was a Finnovation Fellow for 2019/2020. He is a sought after speaker on transgender issues and religion as well as a skilled facilitator of a variety of workshops.

Shannon co-founded QueerTheology.com with Brian G. Murphy. Since its start in 2013, this work has reached more than two million people all over the world through videos, articles, and online courses and community. Their Queer Theology podcast is the longest running LGBTQ+ Christian podcast.

Selected recognition: Winner of the ScreenCraft Pitch competition, finalist for Bull City Film Festival for his pilot Transformed. Winner of the New Hope Film Festival for best premium/tv script. He’s been a playwright in residence at the Inge House, participated in the Seven Devils’ Playwright Conference and the Great Plains Theatre Conference. He was a semi-finalist for the O’Neill and a finalist for the Blue Ink playwriting award.

Shannon’s plays include Laughing, Flexing, Dying, The Stories We Tell At The End Of The World, Body+Blood, in a stand of dying trees, Line of Sight, Twisted Deaths, The Resistance of My Skin, and Who Has Eyes To See.

• Shannon's Website: https://www.shannontlkearns.com/

Welcome to the second season of The BETWEEN Podcast. This short episode features host Matt Mattson encouraging us all to not get sucked into the vortex, the mud pit, the rage machine. We are called to be peacemakers at a time like this. We are called to move our attention away from abstraction and into the up-close-and-personal.

If you're new to the podcast, we focus on the intersection of FAITH (your faith) and HUMAN CONNECTION. We are radically inclusive of all points of view. We are wildly curious and perpetually uncertain. We believe the space between us is the most sacred space on earth.

Learn more about BETWEEN (join our email list) at https://between.church/

Subscribe to our Substack at https://matthewmattson.substack.com/

Learn more about our host Matt Mattson at https://matthew-mattson.com/