On this episode we are joined by Tema Okun.

If you’ve been involved in anti-racism, racial justice, or DEI circles, you’re probably familiar with some of her work, even if you don’t know her name. In our conversations we’ll touch on some of these.

When we speak about “The Article” we’re talking about The Characteristics of White Supremacy Culture” article that she first wrote in 1999, and has since reinterpreted as a website that you can find at whitesupremacyculture.info.

When we speak about her book, we’re discussing “The Emperor Has No Clothes: Teaching about Race and Racism to People Who Don't Want to Know”.

When we speak about “the Ladder”, we’re referencing the ladder of empowerment from white people, which she describes in her 2006 article “From White Racist to White Anti-Racist the life-long journey.” She’ll also mention the corollary piece developed with her colleagues at DismantlingRacism (or drWorks) for people of color.

However, Tema’s humility is both apparent and telling. As she speaks to her own growth and ongoing development, the underlying context of what really matters and what should be important through the lens of her values continues to shine through.

See show notes and more at whitepeoplemakeeverythingaboutrace.com/podcast