In this transformative episode of We Are Human Leaders, we sat down in Sydney with Wendy Smith—renowned expert on paradox and co-author of Both/And Thinking—to explore how shifting from either/or decision-making to both/and thinking can unlock deeper clarity, resilience, and creativity in leadership and life.

Wendy walks us through the concept of paradox: the ongoing, often uncomfortable tensions between seemingly opposing forces (such as stability and change, profit and purpose, or control and flexibility). She shares how these tensions aren't problems to be solved, but dynamics to be navigated, and how ancient wisdom, modern psychology, and business innovation all point to the transformative power of holding space for complexity.

In this conversation, hosts Alexis Zahner and Sally Clarke asked Wendy to unpack:

• The difference between tensions, dilemmas, and paradoxes
• Why binary thinking is limiting—and often harmful
• How leaders and teams can cultivate a paradox mindset
• Practical strategies like the ABCD framework for both/and navigation
• Real-world case studies from IBM, Unilever, and Patagonia
• The link between paradox thinking and ancient Eastern and Indigenous philosophies

This is a conversation that challenges your assumptions and offers tools to lead with greater compassion, nuance, and confidence, especially in times of uncertainty.

Ready to reframe your next challenge not as a dilemma—but as an opportunity? Tune in now, and access the show notes at: www.wearehumanleaders.com/podcast/paradox-thinking-wendy-smith

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