Ever wonder what it looks like to lead with both data and deep humanity across decades of tech evolution?

Today, Charlene sits down with someone who's not just led multi-million and billion-dollar businesses—he's guided thousands of humans through waves of technological change that reshaped entire industries. Charles Stucki is the head of marketing at Neeve, former VP at Cisco, and ex-McKinsey partner. But what sets him apart isn't the titles—it's how he calls himself "the Forrest Gump of tech" and speaks six languages just to connect deeper with people around the world.

They chat about everything from Charles's "get it right this time" philosophy to why he thinks ChatGPT is disrupting marketing in ways no one's talking about yet, to how watching Mary Poppins taught him to be a better father to four daughters.

If you've wondered what it means to stay humble while navigating constant change, this conversation is for you.

Meet Charles Stucki — In 5 Fun Facts

• Witnessed PCs the Size of Suitcases - Used laptops that were literally suitcase-sized at Arthur Andersen doing audits with scissors and brass brads before computers changed everything.
• Learned Italian for a Cruise - Decided he wanted to talk to locals on a 12-day Italy trip, so he taught himself Italian in two months. Now speaks six languages total.
• Swears by Mary Poppins for Parenting - Tells every father to watch this Disney movie to understand how to raise kids. Used it as his guide for raising four daughters successfully.
• Practices Languages Every Single Day - Has a daily routine where he practices one language every day and cycles through all six every week. It's his version of staying human while working.
• Thinks ChatGPT Broke Marketing - Believes AI replacing Google search will destroy everything marketers know, but admits nobody has figured out how to game ChatGPT rankings yet.

"I want to do the right thing in the right way, and rather than trying to have been right all along, I want to get it right this time."- Charles Stucki

[00:02:15] - The goldfish athlete philosophy: Charles's core principle of learning from the past but clearing your mind to focus on present reality.

[00:06:30] - Treating people as partners, not competitors: How viewing colleagues and clients as neighbors rather than threats transforms leadership.

[00:12:45] - The art of selective listening: Why Charles won Cisco's collaboration award and how to listen to understand, not confirm.

[00:18:20] - Leading on two teams simultaneously: Managing up to boards while leading down to thousands of employees.

[00:25:40] - The Forrest Gump of tech: How Charles witnessed every major tech wave from PCs to AI without being the cause.

[00:32:15] - Navigating waves of change: Three principles for staying informed during rapid technological transformation.

[00:38:50] - The ChatGPT marketing disruption: Why search replacement threatens everything marketers know about reaching customers.

[00:44:25] - The Groundhog Day language philosophy: How watching Bill Murray led to learning six languages and becoming a better human.

[00:48:30] - Mary Poppins parenting wisdom: What every father can learn about structure, affection, and adventure from a Disney classic.

3 Key things you can apply today

1. Listen to understand, not confirm. Before any important decision, ask yourself: "Am I listening to validate what I already think, or am I genuinely trying to understand something new?" Seek out people who challenge your...

Ever wonder what happens when someone actually builds operations around people instead of the other way around?

Today, Charlene sits down with someone who's not just building better companies—he's rethinking how people experience work itself. Max Trudel is the COO and co-founder of Evolia, a company reshaping how businesses approach scheduling, time management, and the human side of operations.

Beyond the title, Max is a university lecturer and radio host, and what sets him apart isn't just what he does or what he builds, it's how he builds it. With heart, with intention, and with a deep respect for the humans behind every metric.

They chat about everything from Max's early days saying yes to random opportunities, to the hard conversations that come with scaling a team, to why he still visits customers in person.

If you've wondered what it really means to design a workplace that puts people first, this conversation is for you.

Meet Max Trudel — In 5 Fun Facts

• The Corner Office Kid - While other kids played with toys, Max grew up literally in the corner of his dad's entrepreneurial office. This explains why spreadsheets and business plans feel more natural to him than most people's childhood bedrooms. DNA-level entrepreneurship is real, folks.
• The Pandemic Radio Rebel - When COVID locked everyone behind screens, Max's solution? Start a radio show to meet "real people in real life." Because apparently Zoom fatigue hits different when you're used to being a people person. His cure for digital isolation was going analog.
• The Side-Gig Professor - Most university lecturers tell students to focus on studies. Max actively encourages his students to launch side businesses—then sometimes hires them later. It's like career matchmaking but with extra homework and entrepreneurial chaos.
• The ‘Yes Man’ Evangelist - Max took the Jim Carrey movie "Yes Man" as a life philosophy, not entertainment. He says yes to opportunities first and figures out how they connect later. Spoiler alert: they always connect, just not how you'd expect.
• The SaaS Field Trip Leader - While most SaaS founders worship metrics from their desks, Max actually visits customers to watch them use his product in real life. He wants to see people's faces when they interact with his software, not just their usage statistics.

[00:02:30] - Max's entrepreneurial DNA: Growing up in his dad's office and the natural pull toward entrepreneurship that shaped his entire approach to business.

[00:06:45] - The power of saying yes: How saying yes to seemingly disconnected opportunities creates unexpected career connections and growth.

[00:12:20] - Finding balance as co-founders: The natural division between product and sales that allowed Evolia to grow in a balanced way from the start.

[00:18:10] - Operations as human empowerment: Max's unique perspective on operations being fundamentally about removing friction for people.

[00:23:40] - The empathy of difficult decisions: How firing people with empathy can actually be an act of care for both the individual and the team.

[00:28:15] - Scaling without losing innovators: Keeping problem-solvers and creative thinkers engaged as your company specializes and grows.

[00:35:20] - Partnership communication secrets: Why most agency relationships fail and how to build true partnerships with external...

What if the marketer who's visited 39 countries has discovered the secret to building teams that thrive across time zones and cultures?

Aimen Chouchane went from government advisory to leading marketing at Uptick, serving the fire protection industry across four continents. While other marketers chase generic SaaS playbooks, Aimen discovered his niche audience doesn't live on LinkedIn all day—they're out in the field keeping buildings safe.

Want to know the Wi-Fi research trick that saved his biggest deal? Or how a portable second screen revolutionized his work-travel balance? Aimen shares both.

But wait until you hear about Uptick's mission-driven approach—a company that actually helps keep people safe rather than just peddling software. The philosophy? You'll discover why Aimen refuses to work anywhere that doesn't make the world better.

This isn't your typical marketing interview about funnels and attribution. Discover how a leader blends Tunisian heritage, British pragmatism, and global perspective into marketing strategies that actually work for real people doing real jobs.

"You really can't be a marketer in 2025 if you're not using data... but you still have to use some gut instincts and make some creative calls."

- Aimen Chouchane

• The Country Collector - At 38 turning 39, Aimen's obsessed with keeping his travel count above his age. Currently at 39 countries, he's racing against time—literally. One pandemic slip-up and he was behind, but now he's back on track and plotting his next passport stamp.
• The Wedding Deal Maker - Forget LinkedIn networking events. Aimen's biggest career move happened with a beer in hand at someone's wedding. One friend's startup pitch over cocktails turned into eight years of SaaS marketing madness across four continents.
• The Istanbul Internet Survivor - Nothing teaches you Wi-Fi paranoia like getting yelled at by your boss during a dropped Zoom call. Now Aimen stalks Booking.com reviews searching for "wifi" mentions before booking anything. Turkey taught him the hard way that great download doesn't mean great upload.
• The Rio Sunset Enforcer - Most people say "work-life balance." Aimen says "work until Rio sunset, then beach." His productivity hack? Hard stops that force you to actually finish things instead of pretending to work until midnight.
• The Time Zone Referee - Managing Aussies, Brits, and Americans means someone's always awake and wanting to Slack you. Aimen's solution? Aggressively telling people to stop working after hours because apparently being a good boss means being the productivity police.

[02:30] The Global Marketing Advantage

How traveling to 39 countries transformed Aimen's understanding of customers and cultures. While other marketers rely on personas, Aimen draws from real human experiences across continents to build marketing that resonates with actual people, not demographic data.

[08:15] The Accidental SaaS Journey

From politics degree to government advisory to tech policy consulting, Aimen's career took an unexpected turn when LinkedIn became a client. The revelation that massive companies started as "ideas on a whiteboard" sparked his obsession with early-stage chaos and building something from nothing.

[15:20] Mission-Driven Marketing at Uptick

Why Aimen chose to market fire protection software instead of chasing trendy consumer apps. Uptick keeps public buildings safe by helping companies manage thousands of assets digitally—work that actually matters beyond quarterly metrics and vanity growth.

[20:45] Marketing as Science + Art

Aimen's philosophy on...